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Is it possible for my parents to move in with us? - Page 3 - Carers UK Forum

Is it possible for my parents to move in with us?

Tell us a bit about yourself here.
Diane, once you have PoA you should be legally able to sell your mum's house, downsize, and use the 'profit' to keep the carer going. Remembre your mum is only getting weaker and weaker (thank god)(she's a vile person to you), and really will need less 'care' as she will become more and more incapable, just staring at the walls eventually, so she can be 'left' far more, freeing you up to work (ie, even if the paid carer has to go). Also, DO RUN DOWN HER SAVINGS - this is vital, as if she owns a house, but has no savings, she is entitled to FREE carers coming in (not live in, but enough to do a lot of the drudge work like bathing and feeding etc)(remember you have NO legal duty of care, even if you live in her house).

DO NOT STARVE YOURSELF.
Diane - re CA. Even if your mum has a live in carer, the carer cannot be on 'night duty', which is what you could say YOU do, to get the 15 hour care per week you need to do to qualify for CA. Surely this should swing it for you?
Hi Jenny! :)

Carer and I work well together. She 'clocks off' at 9pm and I take over the night shift though I do sleep too - carer covers 8 am till 10 so I can sleep undisturbed. I also cook all the meals & do all the food shopping plus 'admin - ie ordering prescriptions - arranging nurse visits etc during the day. It also takes the two of us at times through the day to lift mum for toilet breaks as she has gone up two dress sizes since quitting smoking!!
Greta

I did tell the CA promptly when Mother came out of hospital in Dec that I was back caring. I filled in the form online for 'change of circumstances' on Dec 17th. But never heard back. Didn't realise I had to totally reapply after a hospital break of 4/5 weeks?! xx
jenny lucas wrote:
Thu Feb 08, 2018 2:49 pm
HW - that is very helpful - thank you.

You say 'after all debts paid' ...BUT, surely the LA cannot secure a debt against the non-caree co-owner's share of the house, only against the half the caree in residential care home owns??
It will secure a debt against 50% of the value of the house - that being the caree's share. Let's try figures.

Say the house is worth 300,000. A's share is 150,000 and B's share is 150,000. Whichever of them dies first, their share of the house goes to the other, will or no will. That's how joint tenancy works. The shares will be deemed to be 50/50, unless the tenants have legally specified different shares.

Say A is in care and runs up debts of 100,000. Say the 300,000 is after the cost of selling the house and paying off any other debts secured on it. Then the LA takes 100,000 and B is left with 200,000.

Say the care debt is 200,000 (just for the sake of argument). Then the LA won't be able to take more than 150,000, as that is A's share. They can't take money from B's share.

However, if B dies first, it's a different situation. at that point the house is wholly owned by A. so, if the care debts racked up to 200,000, that's what the LA will take, when the house is sold.

As I say, the only way around that is for A's guardian/the perosn named on the LPA, to agree to switch to tenants in common and specify the 50/50 share. Then B can change her will to do what she wished with her share of the house when she dies.
Again, thank you for the clarification.

It sounds like the key points are:

(1) Any care costs of one spouse CANNOT be reclaimed from the share of the other spouse, while the other spouse owns half the property. Care costs can only be claimed against the half share that the spouse-in-care owns. (Phew! Relief!)

(2) For the not-in-care spouse to be able to leave their half of the house directly to their children, rather than a surviving spouse-in-care they have to be tenants in common, not joint tenants.

(3) If they are not yet tenants in common, and the spouse-in-care no longer has legal capacity due to dementia, the only recourse is for the not-in-care spouse to obtain a deputyship via the Court of Protection/Office of the Public Guardian, which is likely to cost 'significantly'....but which should at least be hugely less than the value of their half of the house, so worth doing even if a total pain (and may never be needed since the spouse-in-care may well die first anyway!)

As another question, however, relating to Rob's situation (and many others), presumably, if there is neither a deputyship nor a PoA, and if Rob's dad has lost mental capacity, his wife is not actually allowed to see her property as it is jointly owned with her husband who cannot give consent to the sale....UNLESS she 'forces a sale' through the courts, which I believe is something that any co/part owner of a property is legally entitled to do, even without the consent of the other co-owners. So, without that 'forcing a sale' step, she is 'doomed' to remain in possession of her home, while her husband remains alive.....??
Diane,
Please contact the Carers UK helpline for a definitive answer to your Carers Allowance situation, and possibly entitlement to other benefits.
I'm getting very concerned that there are a few comments on this thread which are very misleading, everyone's position is unique, whilst general discussion is really helpful at times, you need professional advice, which our CUK helpline will give you.
Your mum sounds very disabled, are you aware of NHS Continuing Healthcare? It's a postcode lottery I'm afraid, but even is she doesn't qualify now, it gives a "benchmark" for later, to show if she's gone downhill.
jenny lucas wrote:
Fri Feb 09, 2018 9:15 am
As another question, however, relating to Rob's situation (and many others), presumably, if there is neither a deputyship nor a PoA, and if Rob's dad has lost mental capacity, his wife is not actually allowed to see her property as it is jointly owned with her husband who cannot give consent to the sale....UNLESS she 'forces a sale' through the courts, which I believe is something that any co/part owner of a property is legally entitled to do, even without the consent of the other co-owners. So, without that 'forcing a sale' step, she is 'doomed' to remain in possession of her home, while her husband remains alive.....??
I hadn't thought of that but yes, that follows. Yes, it's possible to obtain a court order (quite a different thing from the PoA/deputyship) to force a sale. However, I suspect the costs are pretty much equal for that or the deputyship - it depends on what local solicitors will charge for either.
jenny lucas wrote:
Thu Feb 08, 2018 2:54 pm
, DO RUN DOWN HER SAVINGS
But only by using the money on her needs. If you spend it on things that aren't to do with her needs, the LA could reclaim the money as 'deprivation of assets'. You can search the site here for that phrase and I've scattered a few links here and there to useful information about that.
Believe me, this is a bad idea.
We moved my husband's mother in with us, and it almost wrecked our marriage.
In your circumstances the financial side of it would bankrupt you, but the emotional stress would be intolerable. My MIL was the mildest person you could imagine until she moved in with us. She became a demanding tyrant almost overnight and eventually lead to my husband leaving his mum in my care and finding somewhere to go every evening, returning around midnight when I'd put her to bed myself.
It wore me into an exhausted wreck and I seriously considered leaving home and letting him look after her.
Consider she may soon need dressing, washing, spoon feeding - and this always falls to the woman (OK the man may help on occasion but only as a novelty 'one off').
Please don't do it!