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Carers UK Forum • Problems/question with care company
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Problems/question with care company

Posted: Fri Nov 22, 2019 7:55 pm
by Susan_1705123
Hi everyone, my mum has dementia and is unable to get out of bed and so relies on other people to do everything for her. At the moment, she has two carers three times a day to do her personal care. My question is, as an example her care plan states her bedtime call is to be from 8pm to 8.45pm. Tonight her carers attended for from 6.55pm for about 9 minutes and then recorded in her notes that they had been with her from 7.30pm to 8.15pm and this happens all the time.Is this normal - is that just what happens? I don't know what to do, do I just let it go.

Re: Problems/question with care company

Posted: Fri Nov 22, 2019 8:27 pm
by Rosemary_1706
That sort of stuff happened to me and my mother. It is wrong in so many ways. The careplan records must be accurate, complete and timely. They are legally required.

There also is fraud going on from the standpoint of billing, whether it's your mum or the LA who's paying.

We found that the carers didn't always come during the preagreed to time slot in the care plan.

You need firm evidence for your compliant to be taken seriously. I used a Ring video doorbell and on occasion would call the LA at the time the carers claimed to be with mum but had left.

I was successful my safeguarding claim against the agency, although it was quite intense.

Getting the carers to come at a specific time is difficult but proper documentation needs to be insisted upon, as does the proper care.

Re: Problems/question with care company

Posted: Fri Nov 22, 2019 8:33 pm
by Rosemary_1706
Whilst I m on the subject, if the carers give your mum medicine (or offer it to mum as they like to say), you might want to check they are properly documenting that in the Medication Administration Record (MAR chart), another legal requirement.

Re: Problems/question with care company

Posted: Fri Nov 22, 2019 8:42 pm
by bowlingbun
That's not acceptable as far as I'm concerned. It's FRAUD!

Can I just check a few things with you? So many people with dementia are missing out on benefits, that I'd just like to make sure mum is getting everything she is entitled to.
Who is paying for mum's care?
Is she receiving Attendance Allowance?
Is she paying Council Tax? People with dementia are EXEMPT from Council Tax from the day of diagnosis, on the grounds of "severe mental impairment".
Are you aware of NHS Continuing Healthcare? Has mum had a CHC Assessment?
When did Social Services last do a Needs Assessment for mum and a Carers Assessment for you?

Re: Problems/question with care company

Posted: Fri Nov 22, 2019 8:51 pm
by Chris From The Gulag
Just in case it's needed ... CHC / NHS Continuing Healthcare ... main thread :

https://www.carersuk.org/forum/support- ... read-35998

Relatively new section on dementia ... just follow the colour :

DEMENTIA ?

Re: Problems/question with care company

Posted: Fri Nov 22, 2019 8:52 pm
by Susan_1705123
Rosemary_1706 wrote:
Fri Nov 22, 2019 8:27 pm
That sort of stuff happened to me and my mother. It is wrong in so many ways. The careplan records must be accurate, complete and timely. They are legally required.

There also is fraud going on from the standpoint of billing, whether it's your mum or the LA who's paying.

We found that the carers didn't always come during the preagreed to time slot in the care plan.

You need firm evidence for your compliant to be taken seriously. I used a Ring video doorbell and on occasion would call the LA at the time the carers claimed to be with mum but had left.

I was successful my safeguarding claim against the agency, although it was quite intense.

Getting the carers to come at a specific time is difficult but proper documentation needs to be insisted upon, as does the proper care.
Hi Rosemary, mum lives with myself and my husband. The carers are from a private care company paid for by the CHC.

Re: Problems/question with care company

Posted: Fri Nov 22, 2019 8:54 pm
by Susan_1705123
bowlingbun wrote:
Fri Nov 22, 2019 8:42 pm
That's not acceptable as far as I'm concerned. It's FRAUD!

Can I just check a few things with you? So many people with dementia are missing out on benefits, that I'd just like to make sure mum is getting everything she is entitled to.
Who is paying for mum's care?
Is she receiving Attendance Allowance?
Is she paying Council Tax? People with dementia are EXEMPT from Council Tax from the day of diagnosis, on the grounds of "severe mental impairment".
Are you aware of NHS Continuing Healthcare? Has mum had a CHC Assessment?
When did Social Services last do a Needs Assessment for mum and a Carers Assessment for you?
Hi, my mu m lives with myself and my husband. She receives attendance allowance as I do also. She has funding from CHC. We have never had a needs assessment.

Re: Problems/question with care company

Posted: Fri Nov 22, 2019 8:55 pm
by Chris From The Gulag
In which case , seek guidance from the area office of the NHS CHC unit ... they are the one's suffering financially as your mother is in the caring department.

Contact details should be in the CHC package issued to you.

Re: Problems/question with care company

Posted: Fri Nov 22, 2019 8:58 pm
by Rosemary_1706
The carers ought to be logging in and out of each visit with their care agency. Companies have different systems. Commonly the carers do that by using their carees' home phones. Others use an electronic tag on the care record folder which is scanned by the carer's mobile phone. So the agency ought to know when and how long the carer is with the client.

One of the agencies mum had pretended they didn't know where the carer was in order for the agency to blame the carers but that is no excuse these days.

Re: Problems/question with care company

Posted: Fri Nov 22, 2019 9:01 pm
by Susan_1705123
Rosemary_1706 wrote:
Fri Nov 22, 2019 8:58 pm
The carers ought to be logging in and out of each visit with their care agency. Companies have different systems. Commonly the carers do that by using their carees' home phone. Others use an electronic tag on the care record folder which is scanned by the carer's mobile phone. So the agency ought to know when and how long the carer is with the client.

One of the agencies mum had pretended they didn't know where the carer was in order for the agency to blame the carers but that is no excuse these days.
Hi Rosemary, they use an electronic tag but at the teamtime call, one of the carers said to the other "don't clock in yet because we are still at so-and-so's house" so they were deliberately not clocking in because they know they are running early!