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prisoners in jail for crimminal acts - Page 2 - Carers UK Forum

prisoners in jail for crimminal acts

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Perhaps more to the point is the question whether prisons are fit for offenders and I think that the answer is no. If you want to stop people reoffending you have to give them the tools to re-enter society, not just punish them for their crimes, and prisons do not do this, there are prisoners serving beyond their original tariffs because the courses which they have to attend to address their offending behaviour in order to qualify for release do not exist in the prisons where they are held, reduce the prison population, especially in the young offenders jails which are frequently no more than schools for crime, and you might see a reduction in the recidivism rate.
I'd like to see much more effort made to stop the kids offending in the first place. The youth services were cut back by Thatcher, as were the extra curricular school activities; some of the kids who cant make the grade academically have nowhere to go except the streets, and they are very vulnerable to bad influences, drugs, alcohol etc.
Young men with poor prospects need adventure, physical challenge, respect from society and responsibility - a chance to excel. They don't need namby pamby "youth forums", they need more sport and the chance to contribute something positive. Crime appears glamorous and risky, it can also pay very well: this has high appeal to testosterone fueled youth.
What is the alternative?
Yeah help all the bad little sods and kids who are decent and don't cause trouble get sod all - how is that fair?

Eun
Yeah help all the bad little sods and kids who are decent and don't cause trouble get sod all - how is that fair?

Eun
I am afraid, Eun, that is untrue, children who cause trouble get very little, many of them do not even get proper parental care or support, children are not born "bad" or "decent", they become "bad", given the correct care, support, education, values, etc. they would be one of your "decent" kids.
I've always felt that some politicians think that children should be unseen and unheard, just schooled and turned into robots who think the way they do. And, like everything else, it really doesn't work that way.

If kids have nothing constructive to do they will find mischief to occupy them. The Tories have a long history of demonising kids and taking away their services. Now they are doing it to their other favourite targets. The unemployed and the disabled - and their carers.

You could say that these groups really are "in it together". The big question is "does anyone else recognise that?"
I've always felt that some politicians think that children should be unseen and unheard, just schooled and turned into robots who think the way they do. And, like everything else, it really doesn't work that way.

If kids have nothing constructive to do they will find mischief to occupy them. The Tories have a long history of demonising kids and taking away their services. Now they are doing it to their other favourite targets. The unemployed and the disabled - and their carers.

You could say that these groups really are "in it together". The big question is "does anyone else recognise that?"
We have a school where I live specifically for children with EBD [anti-social behaviour] it's a huge success, by all accounts they turn these kids life around.
Here is the rub, it is a very small school and to my knowledge the only one in the County, places are extremely limited, it's really just a drop in the ocean to this ever growing problem.
The vast majority of these children are taught along side mainstream kids with very little in the way of help, actually cross that, nothing in the way of help. The really troubled ones who end up with exclusions are placed in special schools which were originally for those with disabilties, they are educated at a level way below what they are capable of, they become even more dissaffected and disruptive and the result is that no child in these schools receive an adequate education and they all leave with the same problems they arrived with many actually worse! The only consistant thing about this is cheap, cheap and even cheaper.
Politicians don't have a clue they occasionally make a one off visit, even OFSTED inspections are well prepared for in that the biggest trouble makers are invariably out on a field trip or some other off site activity on the day. I still cannot believe the atmosphere of chaos my son enters every day, he has no behaviour problems but is treated as though he has and the ones with behaviour problems are dealt with as though they have LD's.
Vicky
I heard about a similar school in Birmingham some time ago, small number of pupils, high staff to pupil ratio, it too was very successful in turning the childrens' lives round and returning them to mainstream education. I do actually think that this sort of provision would be more cost-effective in the long term than the current system where disaffected children become disaffected adults and cause chaos throughout their lives at far greater cost to the taxpayer, including the cost of imprisonment, than the cost of providing timely intervention in childhood.
The Foyer Federation estimates the average true costs of a secure place in custody for a young offender at £100,000 per annum, and argues here that the government deliberately masks the real costs to avoid the public outrage this would cause. After all, its not even as if they work, is it, most of these kids leave with no formal qualifications and end up back in custody - many of them also have very deprived backgrounds and poor parenting - some also have learning disorders, substance abuse and mental health issues: low IQ's are very common:

www.foyer.net/pdf/truecostofyouthcustod ... ngnote.pdf

But it gets worse, a place in a Secure children's home costs £215,000 PA. and a secure training centre £160,000
http://www.publications.parliament.uk/p ... 9w0011.htm
I heard about a similar school in Birmingham some time ago, small number of pupils, high staff to pupil ratio, it too was very successful in turning the childrens' lives round and returning them to mainstream education. I do actually think that this sort of provision would be more cost-effective in the long term than the current system where disaffected children become disaffected adults and cause chaos throughout their lives at far greater cost to the taxpayer, including the cost of imprisonment, than the cost of providing timely intervention in childhood.
The thing is budgets though, LEA don't care about a high SS or penal budget they only care about staying within their own limits or preferably below.
When I spoke to SW last week she was fully aware that a lot of what they provide would not be necessary if the problem had been dealt with effectively when the children are still within the school system, thing is all authorities bang on about early intervention and none of them provide it or at least not as it really needs to be to be effective.
Vicky
They might bang on about early intervention but cuts mean there will be less than ever and things will only get worse.