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15 years sacrifice lost my flat mounting debts - Page 2 - Carers UK Forum

15 years sacrifice lost my flat mounting debts

Share information, support and advice on all aspects of caring.
There's nothing wrong with having differing opinions, folks. Life would be boring without it.

But stress takes a huge toll on carers' health and Kenneth is one more example of this. There are many others - quite a few of us on this site have a lot of stress in our lives, if not all of us. Often it's important to remember that.

Sarniajoy, I understand your point: I've often found that a calm and rational approach gets further but at the end of the day the professional has to listen. If they choose not to listen, then people become increasingly stressed and frustrated, which does no one any good and often leads to an undeserved reputation. Some carers have been deemed too aggressive for lone social workers to visit, where the real problem was that the carers had found that they got nowhere without shouting.

Too many carers have to fight for everything and end up shouting first to save time because that is what the system has taught them to do. So who is wrong?
[quote]There's nothing wrong with having differing opinions, folks. Life would be boring without it.

But stress takes a huge toll on carers' health and Kenneth is one more example of this. There are many others - quite a few of us on this site have a lot of stress in our lives, if not all of us. Often it's important to remember that.

Sarniajoy, I understand your point]

My husband was a head teacher and a good one. He was more than happy to listen to parents who had problems, and do what he could to help if they approached him in a reasonable manner. The moment anyone showed aggression they were escorted off the premises , and if they refused to leave the police were called. Aggession should NEVER be tolerated by professionals! All too often people demand help with an aggressive posture and so it is not surprising if they don't get the response they hope for. Professionals are only human too and an aggressive client can be very scary!
It would be great to live within a system where aggression was never needed. Unfortunately the system treats carers with such contempt that people feel the only way to get listened to is to shout louder than the person next to you.

I have seen it work in practice-where people have entered the housing office or the benefits office, shouting and swearing and they have been ushered into a private office and come out smiling when they have got what they wanted.

I myself have been in situations where I have made such a fuss that I have been threatened that they would call the police. I would have welcomed the police and resulting court case to get publicity for my needs, but once they know that, they never call the police.

I am not saying it is right-but if people are driven to desperation they have nothing to lose, and I mean real desperation to the point you no longer care if you live or die.
This is a sad fact of our times, that the police have to be called for aggression. When I was nursing, there were times I was spoken to aggressively, and at times whilst I was the only nurse on duty on a ward, but the only time the police were ever called was when a poor old man with senile dementia needed reassurance, and we thought a police uniform might help him.

It takes two people to be reasonable. Your husband Sarniajoy, sounds as though he cared about what he was doing, and that makes all the difference. I bet he didn't have too many people being aggressive to him, as his attitude was likely to have been supporting.

I have always tried to be reasonable when makng a request. I was brought up to respect people, but many within Social Services are so busy watching their backs that they are afraid to become involved and do their job properly.Our son has a new Social Worker, since about four months ago, and the confidence he feels in her is great. She has taken time to get to know him and his interests, and asks his opinion about what he wants in life.But we have had to get another porfessional in to start that support, as I was informed his care was being transferred to another Social Worker, and he was not being given a chance to express his views and feelings. He was really anxious, and if I had not called an Advocate for support, then it could have been just to'ing and fro'ing through e-mails,and not getting anywhere.Even the Advocate had to bring points of law in, before she was listened to.

I certainly had to make a fuss about ten years ago, when my husband had been told by an Eye Hospital, that one eye needed urgent laser therapy to stop him being going blind in that eye. They could only do it in six weeks time, which would be too late. Our local Eye Specialist refused to see my husband, even with that information(oh, and by the way my husband had recently lost all of the sight in his other eye, and that could have been avoided if treatment had been earlier), and I contacted Diabetes UK, who told me to stand up and scream for help if I had to!The specialist phoned me that afternoon, and my husband was seen the next day(and the only people to lose out for my husbands late NHS appointment were the private patients that the specialist normally saw in NHS time)

One of my sons was told he had diabetic eye problems two years ago, and needed to be referred. We had a letter saying that the waiting list was up to 2 years. Again I made a fuss,
and wrote to my MP,and the Welsh Assembly have looked into this and say it is not good enough. Times have to be improved for Diabetic Eye patients.It is the most common cause of blindness and often preventable.A friend of mine, whose son became diabetic at the same age as my son, eight months, lost his sight last year,at age 20.My son is now getting better support and his eyes seem to have sorted themselves out for now.(probably temporary, as the same happened with my husband)

I dislike making a fuss, and will try reason always,but know how it is to feel desperate, and to say to someone "please, please, listen to me, I beg you".On the other hand , it makes a big difference to be treated respectfully. I was recently in the council offices , and had to wait in a queue with two people ahead of me, for 55 minutes. One man in front of me was disabled, and was unable to sit down or stand up with any comfort, and after 45 minutes, he left, as he was in unbearable pain. Two ladies behind me were on their teabreak from work, and had to get back, but were needing to pay their rent. I was stressed, but the lady at the counter when I got there was very courteous and apologised as someone had gone off sick , after coming to work, and they were waiting for an alternative. That meant I didn't feel tense any more, and that lady used good manners to defuse stressed members of the public.
Professionals are only human too and an aggressive client can be very scary!
Agreed but they also have a duty to act in a proffesional manner.
Many don't and use the resulting aggression that comes from their lack of thought,actions or attitude as a get out.
Not a thought that many proffesional like as so often they fail to take action on work mates who are like that. Image
It takes two people to be reasonable. Your husband Sarniajoy, sounds as though he cared about what he was doing, and that makes all the difference. I bet he didn't have too many people being aggressive to him, as his attitude was likely to have been supporting.

Yes he did care very much indeed and did much that was above and beyond the call of duty, but he did expect others to behave reasonably too. If you confront professionals with all guns blazing then it isn't surprising if you don't get the best of attention. No one should be expected to put up with a rude or violent client. By the same token the professionals must behave in a professional manner and do their best for their clients, but they cannot be expected to walk on water! Reading some of the comments on this forum I do think that some expect the impossible!
It's easy to judge people by their posts, but not the most accurate way. Few of us tell all on here or any other site.

Professionals have a duty to be reasonable: they are trained to support people but don't always do so: the reasons will vary, but some are simply unprofessional. Others are so careful to stay within budget that no one gets help until they've gone beyond crisis.

It's all too easy to make someone feel that you are not listening.

The vast majority of carers I've come across are perfectly reasonable people who will ask politely for help. But if they are ignored, sidelined, told they are not eligible for something they know others in similar situations have received or treated as imbeciles, then some of them are so stressed that they will fight back.

And gain an undeserved reputation for aggression.

It's good that your husband was one of the better professionals, Sarniajoy. And there will always be people who are unreasonable (on both sides of the divide). And there will always be times when logical and calm approaches no longer work, and a little righteous anger springs forth. Whether it truly works or not is another thing.

My own view is that it may work once or twice, but then people get used to your ways and ignore you again. And you have nowhere else to go.
Reading some of the comments on this forum I do think that some expect the impossible!
Nope just their job devoid of any of their own personal opinions.
I have seen that attitude of preventing or making life difficult for people from proffesionals simply due to what THEY think the other person should be allowed.
Yes it can be hard to be faced with SOME people who are playing and abusing the system,any system.
However that should not colour the responsive given as part of your job.
As the DWP is almost a family proffesion,from front desk work right up to a high level i am aware of both sides of the coin.
But i have seen and fought for other people that have faced just such an attitude.
From many proffesionals who display a remarkable lack of empathy Image
they cannot be expected to walk on water! Reading some of the comments on this forum I do think that some expect the impossible!
I find that comment unnecessary and offensive. Image

Nobody is asking for any more than the law requires: professional people with a remit to provide care & support to do just that!!
Too often professionals do not provide even the basics of a decent service as unfortunately both my own and others here have experienced.

I do not believe in approaching things with an aggressive manner but the incompetence and lack of the 'duty of care' services particularly in N.H.S. allows me to understand why others have needed to go to such lengths, I do not judge them.
There's enough of that else where. Image

marie x
they cannot be expected to walk on water! Reading some of the comments on this forum I do think that some expect the impossible!
I find that comment unnecessary and offensive. Image

Nobody is asking for any more than the law requires: professional people with a remit to provide care & support to do just that!!
Too often professionals do not provide even the basics of a decent service as unfortunately both my own and others here have experienced.

I do not believe in approaching things with an aggressive manner but the incompetence and lack of the 'duty of care' services particularly in N.H.S. allows me to understand why others have needed to go to such lengths, I do not judge them.
There's enough of that else where. Image

marie x
Excellent post.
Well put. Image