CARERS STRATEGY 2018 : Green Paper Effects On CarerLand : YOUR FUTURE : BEING DECIDED BY OTHERS ? OUR VIEWS !!!

Discuss news stories and political issues that affect carers.
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Nationwide consultations ... second time that notion has cropted up recently.

CAMPAIGNS SECTION and on Carers Radio a couple of days ago.

Any reader been " Consulted ? "

Know someone who has been ?

Local report anywhere on the Internet ... search reveals zilch.

Carers UK were consulted a few months back ... earlier posting ... todate , no report of those " Consultations " published.

" That Plan " ... denounced for what it was a few weeks back ... fingerprints of both our supporting organisations on it ???

Little perturbed as we could be missing out on something here ... ???

Last thing we want is ... " After consulting with carers nationwide , here it is ... the star of the show ... The Green Paper ! "

Read through and ... as expected ... nothing on finances , nor free / affordable support services.

We've been had ?
The findings published last week were put together with input from A Citizens assembly (or some other wordings can't remembr details) of 'nearly 50' yes, nearly 50 people. A tiny drop in the ocean statistically. There was a section saying more about this 'assembly' but I didnt read it, sorry

The link was in the thread I set up... will look for it again
Thanks Mrs. A ... my bill continues to increase !

Unless I'm mistaken , a link to THE " Citizens Assembly " on social care through the UK Parliament web site :

https://www.parliament.uk/business/comm ... faq-17-19/

Worth posting in full ... as the future of 6.5 million family carers MAY hang on whatever comes out of such meetings :
A citizens' assembly is a group of people who are brought together to discuss an issue or issues, and reach a conclusion about what they think should happen. The people who take part are chosen so they reflect the wider population – in terms of demographics (e.g. age, gender, ethnicity, social class) and sometimes relevant attitudes (e.g. preferences for a small or large state).

Citizens' Assembly considers best way of funding adult social care
Inquiry: Long term funding of adult social care
Committees' report: Long-term funding of adult social care
Citizens' Assembly report: Citizens' Assembly on Social Care
Health and Social Care Committee
Housing, Communities and Local Government Committee

Citizens' assemblies give members of the public the time and opportunity to learn about and discuss a topic, before reaching conclusions. Assembly Members are asked to make trade-offs and arrive at workable recommendations.

Citizens' assemblies, and other similar methods, have been used in the UK and other countries - including Australia, Canada, and the United States – to address a range of complex issues. A citizens’ assembly is currently taking place in the Republic of Ireland – established by the Irish Parliament – to address a number of important legal and policy issues facing Irish society. These have included equal marriage, abortion and the opportunities and challenges of an ageing population.

What will the Citizens’ Assembly on Social Care consider?

The Citizens' Assembly on Social Care will consider the question of how adult social care in England should be funded long term. This includes issues like how much individuals should have to pay themselves, versus how much should be publicly funded. It will cover adult social care for both older and working age adults.

Adult social care is the support provided to adults with physical or learning disabilities, or physical or mental illnesses. It includes support for older people, and also for some working age adults with disabilities or illnesses. The support could be for personal care (such as eating, washing, or getting dressed) or for domestic routines (such as cleaning or going to the shops).
Why hold a Citizens’ Assembly on Social Care?

Social care provision and funding has been the subject of numerous reports, commissions and Government papers over many years. Despite agreement on the urgent need for reform, this has not translated into action or consensus on how it should be achieved.

Ahead of the Government's Green Paper, the Health and Social Care Select Committee and the Housing, Communities and Local Government Select Committee are holding a short inquiry to identify funding reforms which will command broad consensus, and which will enable the Government to make swift and tangible progress in this area.

Citizens' assemblies have been effective in the UK and internationally at a) giving decision-makers a detailed understanding of informed public opinion on complex issues; and b) opening up the space for political consensus to be found.
Who is running the Citizens’ Assembly on Social Care?

The Health and Social Care Select Committee and the Housing, Communities and Local Government Select Committee have commissioned the Citizens' Assembly as part of their joint inquiry into the long term funding of adult social care.

The Assembly is being organised by Involve - a public participation charity that works to put people at the heart of decision-making. Involve are experts in how to design, facilitate and project manage citizens’ assemblies, as well as other methods that enable the public to participate in decision-making.

Two charitable foundations - the Esmee Fairbairn Foundation and The Omidyar Network - have also contributed funds, but have no involvement in the Assembly’s design or delivery.

How will the recommendations of the Citizens’ Assembly on Social Care be taken on board?

The Assembly's recommendations will feed into the joint inquiry by the Health and Social Care Select Committee and the Housing, Communities and Local Government Select Committee. The Select Committees' Members will consider them, alongside other evidence submitted to the inquiry, when deciding on their own recommendations for how adult social care should be funded. The Assembly’s findings will also be published separately on the Committees' website.

Who are the Assembly Members?

The Citizens' Assembly on Social Care will be made up of 45 to 50 English citizens who are eligible to vote in UK general elections. The members are being recruited with the help of ICM to be representative of the English population in terms of age, gender, ethnicity, socio-economic group, place of residence, and attitudes towards a small/large state. They will include people with direct experience of social care for both working age adults and older people.

In order to encourage and support participation, Assembly Members are provided with an honorarium of £150 per weekend.
There is no option to directly apply to be a member of the Citizens' Assembly as members are selected randomly (through a process called random stratified sampling) to ensure they are representative of the general public.

When and where will the Assembly meetings take place?

The Assembly will meet over two weekends (27th-29th April and 18th-20th May) in central Birmingham.

What will happen during the Assembly meetings?

At the first weekend, Assembly Members will hear from expert contributors who together reflect the range of views on how adult social care should be funded. Assembly Members will hear presentations from the contributors and spend time questioning them. They will discuss what they say in small groups, identifying the issues and arguments that they feel to be most important.

At the second weekend, Assembly Members will discuss what they have heard and reach a set of recommendations. To do this they will work through a series of exercises, involving small groups discussions, as well as some voting and ranking of options.

The weekends will be led by professional facilitators and there will also be facilitators on each table. It’s their role to make sure everyone can be heard and feels comfortable, as well as to explain each of the exercises. Facilitators only explain and answer questions about the Assembly’s process - any questions about the issue under discussion (i.e. social care) get referred to the Assembly’s Expert Lead, Professor Martin Knapp from the London School of Economics.

How do you ensure that the Assembly is accessible to everyone?

It is important, particularly on a subject such as social care, that a citizens’ assembly is accessible to everyone. This is ensured in a number of ways.

The costs of members attending the Assembly are covered in full, including providing travel, accommodation and meals. In addition, Assembly Members are provided with an honorarium of £150 per weekend in order to encourage and support their participation.

This both recognises the time that Assembly Members are giving up to take part and ensures that a diverse range of participants (e.g. including those on low-incomes, unemployed, with caring responsibilities, etc.) can participate.

The venue for the Assembly is fully accessible and all accessibility requirements of Assembly Members are taken into account. This includes, where needed, providing materials in Braille or large print and sign language interpretation. The costs of carers, respite care and child care are also covered where needed.

The Assembly proceedings are carefully designed to enable the full participation of all members. Small group work ensures that all participants are able to contribute and have time to reflect and develop their own opinions, particularly those less confident in public speaking. The exercises and techniques that are used are specifically designed to support Assembly Members to engage with complex information and feel able to put their opinion forward, with no prior knowledge needed.

How will you ensure that the information Assembly Members receive is balanced and accurate?

In order to ensure balance and accuracy, an Expert Lead has been appointed to advise on the selection of expert contributors and development of materials. The Expert Lead, Professor Martin Knapp from the London School of Economics, is well respected for his knowledge and impartiality on the subject of social care.

In addition, an Advisory Panel is supporting preparations for the Citizens’ Assembly on Social Care. Its role is to help ensure that the Assembly’s plans and materials are factually accurate, comprehensive, balanced and unbiased.


The Advisory Panel Members are:

Caroline Glendinning, University of York
James Lloyd, formerly of the Strategic Society Centre
Kari Gerstheimer, Mencap
Raphael Wittenberg, London School of Economics
Warwick Lightfoot, Policy Exchange


Who are the expert contributors?

Assembly members will hear from a range of expert contributors, selected to cover the breadth of opinion on how social care should be funded.

Speaking on options for how any private financing (i.e. by individuals) of the system should work and views on the optimal balance between private and public financing, Assembly Members will hear from: Anna Bailey-Bearfield, Care and Support Alliance; Dominic Carter, Alzheimer’s Society; Emily Holzhausen, Carers UK; Jim Boyd, Reform; and Simon Bottery, Kings Fund.

Speaking on options for how any public financing of the system should work and views on the optimal balance between private and public financing, Assembly Members will hear from: Edward Davies, Centre for Social Justice (tbc); Jane Vass, Age UK; Jon Glasby, University of Birmingham; Mike Date, Mencap; Sarah Pickup, Local Government Association.


Is it possible to observe the process?

There are a limited number of spaces for observers. Observing would allow you to see how the citizens’ assembly process functions. However, observers are unable to join tables to listen into discussion and deliberation as this can change how participants engage with the process.

To request an observer spot please contact Becca Bunce.

Is it possible to interview participants?

This will not be possible on the first weekend, however there may be an opportunity on the second weekend.

Participants are anonymous throughout the process. On the second weekend we will give participants the option to waive anonymity in order to speak to the media.

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As posted earlier , full report of a similar " Pony and Trap " show a decade ago is available ... with a FULL breakdown on all matters discussed.

At least a decade ago , the DWP were present ... as were their minders ?

Not this one ?

Good indication that the word FINANCES would be a topic NOT to be even considered ???

And no Professor Luke Clements ???

Perhaps by posting that warning to us he was not invited ... mores the pity ... probably the only academic that I have faith in !

Carers Strategy would tie in ... FUNDING ... unless , of couse , someone glanced at Carers UK and the words " Carers ? No problem " were taken as read ... no problem then , proposals include their contribution ... nice to be consulted ????

Simmering ... still simmering ... what else did I , or you , expect.

Our future ... and the number of CARERS who attended ???

Perhaps Carers UK , who were represented there ,would publish a full sp ?

Simmering ... just simmering ... honest !
That was the aim
The reality was documented in here
https://www.carersuk.org/forum/news-and ... 2018-33728
Follow the link to "2 committees " then to the 4 or 5 documents on the Citizens assembly wot was actually assembled
MrsAverage wrote:
Sun Jul 01, 2018 9:46 pm
That was the aim
The reality was documented in here
https://www.carersuk.org/forum/news-and ... 2018-33728
Follow the link in the news report to "2 committees " then to the 4 or 5 documents on the Citizens assembly wot was actually assembled
Whoops. Didnt mean to quote myself. Meant to edit it :silly:
Yep ... most of the BBC report added already within the second CS thread.

Typical ... both threads virtually converged a month ago ... now back into the separate cages ... FUNDING OF SOCIAL CARE ( Affects us INDIRECTLY ) / NEWS ON THE CS ( DIRECT impact on CarerLand ) ... both emerging out of the run up to the Green Paper.

Like our own supporting organisations , barely a rizla cigarette paper between them ... and yet , separate from each other ?
Having just posted a snippet from an article on the other Green Paper thread , one of the comments from that article is worth repeating on this one.


If the children can't be bothered to look after their elderly parents, then I suppose the taxpayer has no alternative but do it for them.

They can hardly be left in the gutter.

But at the same time, there's no reason such selfish children should expect to benefit from their parents' assets, so it seems perfectly reasonable for the state to take them to refund any cost the taxpayer incurs in paying for that care.




Joe Public speaks ... plenty more out there if one trawls through the Internet.

If one knew nothing about family carers / CarerLand , not an attitude to reasonably assume ?

" Their your parents , why should I have to help pay for them ? "

Same could be said for children ?

CUK ... YOUR message ... still not being heard ... or understood ???
Well ... Jeremy didn't last long ?

Matt Hancock is the new brat on the block.

TheyWorkForYou form book :

https://www.theyworkforyou.com/mp/2477 ... st_suffolk

" She sells seashells " amongst other 3 word alliterative phrases commonly used in speeches !

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Interest in horses / horse racing ?

A racing certainty he'll fall at the first on social care ???

Speech from 2012 worth recording ... on the funding aspect :

One day, Mr Deputy Speaker, you, like me, God willing, will grow old. I want to concentrate on the UK’s care system for the elderly. We have heard much today about benefits and changes to Remploy, but I want to focus a bit more on something that was touched on earlier—the need to provide social care for our elderly and for those with permanent and long-term disabilities, and the urgent need for reform.

I am motivated in this by thinking not only of my own growing old—I hope—and of all those in this Chamber, but family experience and my experience of supporting a friend of my age who, at the age of 28, sadly had a stroke and is now confined to a wheelchair and has to live with permanent care.

Supporting him, and starting a trust to support him, gave me the personal experience of trying to navigate the care system for those with permanent disabilities, and it brought into sharp relief the difficulties that that brings to many people who support disabled people, whether they are of what would otherwise be working age or in old age.

The Dilnot commission has been the most important step forward in this area for many years. Criticisms of inaction can be levelled not only at the previous Government but at previous Governments. This is an area where cross-party support and a lack of political tension is necessary.

Over the past decade, 200,000 people have sold their homes to pay for their care. Yet more people, who did not have assets, have had to survive with substandard care. BUPA has estimated that in a decade, there will be a shortfall of 100,000 care home places unless action is taken.

In the same period that spending on the NHS has risen by about £25 billion, spending on social care for the elderly has risen by only £43 million. Given that 400,000 elderly people are in care homes and that more than £7 billion was announced for this area in the spending review, we need to ensure that Government support is focused and that financial support is brought in from wherever possible to strengthen this crucial sector.

I pay tribute to the work that the Minister has done to bring forward proposals and ensure that we are moving in the right direction. The introduction of carers breaks is a welcome step forward. I warmly welcome the linking of social care and health care budgets in the Health and Social Care Act 2012, which will tie together what have too often been disparate functions.

It is clear that there is also a need for reform in self-funding. There must be support for vulnerable elderly people who do not have access, but we must also ensure that those who do have access do not have to lose their home to pay for their care. The problem is the lack of an insurance market.

We can insure all sorts of things in life. The moustache of Mervyn Hughes, the great cricketer, was once insured for £200,000. Kylie Minogue’s rear was insured for $5 million, Heidi Klum’s legs for $2 million and Cristiano Ronaldo’s legs for €100 million. However, I cannot take out insurance for the possibility that I will have to spend many years in social care. Nobody in this country can insure against the small chance that they will need very expensive care in their old age.

The problem is the uncertainty over the cost. For many of us, there will be no care costs at all. For most of us, the costs will be relatively small. For a small proportion of people, however, there will be very high and uncertain costs. There is a role for Government in ensuring that the market works in tackling the uncertainty. There is uncertainty over not only what the cost will be, but who will be hit with the cost.

That brings me to the final point about why this matter is so important. This is not only a practical problem, but a problem of values. Those who save hard and work hard for their whole life feel that they are penalised by a care system that takes away what they have worked for.

Those who put money aside and save for their retirement look for a something-for-something system in which people get out according to what they put in. We must look after our most vulnerable and end the scandal of people being forced to sell their homes to pay for their care. I hope that we will come forward soon with serious proposals to take this injustice away.


Wasn't the Minister then ... we shall see ... seashells ???

Hancock's Half Hour revived ?

Won't be a patch on the original !

The original was funny !

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Perhaps the infamous Galton and Simpson will come out of retirement to write his speeches ???
Always interesting to see how our comrades across the water are progessing in comparison for what passes for supporting organisations over here.


http://familycarers.ie/43-per-cent-of-g ... -progress/



43 per cent of Government’s National Carers’ Strategy’s objectives have seen acceptable progress.


12 July 2018 : Family Carers Ireland today launches its fourth ‘Family Carers’ Scorecard’ (2.6 MB) reviewing progress of the National Carers’ Strategy and appealing for a new, funded strategy in Budget 2018. Ireland’s first National Carers’ Strategy, published in 2012, has now run its course. However, from a carers’ perspective, only 18 of 42 actions have achieved acceptable progress.

“Family carers were willing to accept a cost-neutral strategy in 2012 as a token of recognition for their work when the country was in financial crisis. We have now exhausted all possibilities of further progress without investment. In Budget 2018, we have asked Government for dedicated funding for the next National Carers’ Strategy 2018-2022 to address the serious issues and concerns faced by family carers” said Catherine Cox, Family Carers Ireland.

“We need respite care urgently to give family carers a vital break – and we are seeing the physical and mental health of carers across the country compromised due to lack of supports. Family carers not being involved in planning the care of their loved ones remains a serious issue.

Carers still report feeling side-lined or uninformed, and underequipped to take on the role of caring for a loved one discharged from hospital. The existing six-step HSE guide to discharge and transfer from hospital is simply not having the desired effect.

Family carers also need financial support, particularly to help with the hidden costs of caring. These can include everyday costs such as increased heating and electricity bills and can extend to adaptation of the home. On this last point it is essential that the Housing Adaptation Grant crisis is resolved.”


Almost all of us will either provide or require care at some stage in our lives. 2015 figures from the Central Statistics Office suggest that 10 per cent of the population provide care, which would be approximately 360,000 people*.


Of the 42 objectives in the National Carers’ Strategy, one action has been implemented in full and is making a real difference to family carers’ lives.

Seventeen actions have received a ‘Good Progress’ score; 11 have received ‘initial progress’; 8 have received ‘No Progress’ and 5 have received a ‘Regressive’ score, meaning the situation has worsened for family carers since the strategy was launched. These include:

( Note : These problems ... seem familiar ? )

A serious lack of respite care, vital to give family carers a much-needed break to continue their caring work. Due to funding cuts, staff shortages and bed closures because of HIQA inspections, respite has become almost non-existent – a serious issue for family carers.

Family carers should be considered as partners in care planning by health and social service providers. This relates to discharge planning from hospital to homecare and is simply not happening. The lived experience of family carers in this regard is very poor, with often no documented care plans or supports in place to help family carers provide care in a safe and dignified manner.

Problems with the Housing Adaptation Grant scheme persist around the country – despite an older population increase of 36 per cent since 2006. Eligibility for the scheme has been tightened to the point where those in genuine need are not eligible. While funding is slowly being restored and currently stands at €56m, it is still significantly below the funding level paid in 2010 of €95m. Long waiting lists are seen in many Local Authorities and timeliness is a huge issue, as needs may significantly deteriorate while an applicant is waiting.


On a more positive note, Government have expressed a willingness and ambition to tackle the issue of financing home and community care. This is evidenced by the terms of reference of the Committee on the Future of Healthcare and by the announcement of a public consultation to establish a new statutory homecare scheme.

Equally positive has been the improving level of engagement from Government departments with family carers over the lifetime of the Strategy.


Speaking at today’s launch is Shirley Thornton from Dublin. Alongside parenting her son, Lewis (11) alone, Shirley was the sole carer for her parents. Following the passing of her father Lewis (87), she now cares full-time for her mother Eva (83) at home. Shirley has faced and still faces many challenges, including not being given her allocated home help hours and having to focus on minding herself, to care for three other people.

Also present at the launch was Young Carer of the Year 2016, Úna McNicholas (18), who helps care for her older sister Elizabeth (28) for the past eight years. Elizabeth was healthy and active up to the age of 18 when she suddenly became ill. She is now with severe brain and spinal injuries and has developed a sleeping disorder and Adrenal Insufficiency – a life-threatening condition. She is confined to her bed, and uses a wheelchair when she is up. Úna misses out on some of the activities of her class mates and loves school, which she considers ‘a break’. She had to take care of her sister when her dad had a heart attack last year.

“Government has said that carers are a backbone of care provision in Ireland. They need to back this up with a properly funded, new National Carers’ Strategy” said Catherine Cox, speaking at today’s launch of Family Carers Ireland’s ‘Family Carers’ Scorecard’ in Dublin.

Family Carers Ireland provides a range of supports and services for family carers through its 22 resource centres nationwide and advocates fairness for carers. The organisation is currently running it’s ‘Share the Care’ campaign to help family carers self-identify and seek supports.


For any readers not familiar with the Irish supporting organisation set up :

Family Carers Ireland is a registered charity (number CHY 10962) and a company limited by guarantee, emerging from the coming together of two long standing charities of over 25 years – The Carers Association and Caring for Carers in 2016. The merger brings the best of both charities together whilst broadening the range of services and supports to family carers and giving one national voice to represent fairness for carers.


https://www.carersuk.org/forum/news-and ... h%20carers


In essence , and whilst still " Charities " in the Irish mode , this organisation is very much in the front line as opposed to " Ivory Towers. "

12 years since their merger and they continue to monitor the progress of their Government in implimenting the Irish Carers Strategy which entered the arena in 2012.

As far as comparisons go , many of the last UK Carers Strategy " Promises " in 2009 remain an illusion.

Somehow , I don't see our supporting organisations having a " Scorecard " ... that would be too hot for them to handle ???
80 posts