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21 HOUR RULE ? CA : Eligibility / Studying / Developments : The Sole Thread ANYWHERE Dealing With This Abomination ! - Carers UK Forum

21 HOUR RULE ? CA : Eligibility / Studying / Developments : The Sole Thread ANYWHERE Dealing With This Abomination !

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76 posts
Straight off the Government web site on eligibility to receive CA.

you’re not studying for 21 hours a week or more

Okay , my question is .... Has this " Absurdity " ever been challenged by our supporting organisations ? Or merely accepted without a murmur.

Any reader can carve up 168 hours a week into segments to demonstrate the artificial nature of this barrier.

Seems so obvious , so why no challenge on behalf of all those caught out ? Fair old number if one looks back to when this barrier was first bought in.

After all , when making a donation , don't donors hope that the beneficiaries of whatever charity will receive something in return ? A little practical help occasionly ?

It so often the case that the things most carers take for granted aren't worth the paper they were written on when subject to scrutiny.

Let sleeping carers lie .... ???

What they don't know can't hurt them ???
The subject is quite complicated as to what actually constitutes 'full' or 'part' time studying. The Carers UK fact sheet has more information and the Adviceline will be able to give more specific advice based on individual circumstances.

http://www.carersuk.org/help-and-advice ... -allowance (about halfway down).

there are also a fact sheets available from the NUS.
Thanks Susie.

Pages 5 / 6 .... compared with the carving up of 168 hours into segments ... does not address the problem , and adds confusion to a simple deduction.

So , no challenge then ... by anyone , even in collabration with the NUS ?

I have emailed the NUS via their online email system to seek their view on this same issue.

I hope they don't ask me for my membership number. Lost sight of the original card sometime in 1970 !

I'll post their reply when ( if ) received.
I do believe that there have been challenges as the CUK factsheet mentions "case law"
You are not in full-time education

The meaning of 'full-time education' is complicated and may depend on a number of factors including the type of course you are doing.

Your course is likely to be considered 'full-time' if:

your university, school or college describe the course as full-time (however there is some case law which suggests that some courses classed as ‘full-time’ may in fact not be classed as ‘full-time’ by the Carer’s Allowance Unit if the actual course is for less than 21 hours a week - this is complicated so contact the Carers UK Adviceline for further advice); or
you are required to do 21 hours a week or more of study (even if your university, school or college does not describe your course as full-time)
If you are in full-time education you also won’t be able to get Carer’s Allowance during temporary absences from your course including holiday periods.

If you are studying or thinking about studying then contact the Carers UK Adviceline for further advice.
I've had a quick google search but haven't come up with anything yet. I do know that a previous member here who was studying law did try to appeal but I can't remember the outcome ! (it was quite a few years ago)
Thanks Susie.

I doubt if any reader or member of our supporting organisations can see the " Logic " with this one.

So obvious when subject to scutiny and yet allowed to continue ?

Someone somewhere is definately having a laugh at the expenses of all those who are / have been subject to it.

Not even in the same category as the running argument on CA being stopped once a carer reaches the official retirement age ... the old look one way it's a benefit , look the other and it's a wage trick.

Perhaps a new one regarding the time a carer is asleep ... is he / she caring during those hours ... from my stint , I was woken up whenever my caree blew her bugle , a present from the local SS to " Help " with my caring duties ... even had to pay for most of the postage as the idiots only put a second class stamp on the package !

Be thankfull for small mercies ? At least I could throw away the collar and lead.
Further thought whilst awaiting the NUS to reply.

Current carers wanting to increase their chances of emplyment by studying for further qualifications only to be faced with the same 21 hour problem.

I seem to recall a couple of our regular posters pointing out this restriction in the past ?

Given the Government's policy of wanting everyone in some form of paid employment , would the 21 hour restriction fall foul of the Equalities Act ?

Does it , or something similar , apply to a disabled person receiving PIP ?

If not , almost the same argument ... discrimination by association ... when looking at the Carers Concessory Travel issue ?

I leave the answer to that one to other readers.
Quite a few universities now have carer reps on various boards. I have no idea if they are actually listened to and any action taken though.

This may interest you in meantime , out 2 days ago
https://carers.org/news-item/student-ca ... s-scotland

x x
Going higher in Scotland

x x
Par for the course.

Interesting to read , no clear mention of the 21 hour rule ???

Concentrating on students with caring responsibilities , nothing on supporting carers who want to study but cannot do so because of the 21 hour rule ???

Still , with all that fresh money swashing around , it has to be spent somewhere ???

A donation to Trussells would not go amiss considering they are seeing upto 20 times the number of carers through their doors every week than they have in their own ranks ???

Think on that one ....

Supporting as opposed to " Lobbying " ... when was the last time either supporting organisation raised this issue with the powers to be ?

All Party Carers Group ? Departmentment of Education ?

As expected , Issues of this priority not even mentioned in passing on Carers Day in the House ?

No record on Hansard of a former vice president of the Voice , and labour mp , raising this matter in the House.

Similar to the ongoing thread on Carer Concessionary Travel , but even stronger ?

Given the numbers involved , and barrier to further learning ( Somewhat essential for former carers ) , one to be passed over to the Policy Team once a reply is received from the NUS with their views ?

After all , the Government want as many working as possible , why this hurdle , particularly to both existing and former carers ( those who know that their caring days are numbered ).

That old chesnut " Discrimination by Association " may crop up again in this context.

Anything from prior meetings that throw some light on this ?

Unless something recent overrides the deductions on this one , a joint venture seems to be the way forward.

If volunteers are needed to assist the Policy Team , I'm sure that there are many carers , former or otherwise , ready and willing to pitch in. Even an odd cup / mug of coffee would be sufficent reward for helping carers over this abominable hurdle.

Only some 6 million+ carers , time to galvanise support for the Common Good ?

What's often taken for granted doesn't always have to be the case ???
Now in direct contact with a " Mr. X " at the NUS.

Seems to be a slight problem in understanding plain English , like most academics , miss out an ology and they will not understand.

Anyway , let's see how the modern generation of students handle this issue from their perspective.


Thankfully not this lot , latest rejects on their way to the DWP for training before being let loose in job centres. Certainly would be an improvement in some ?

I've thrown in the travel concession issue just to test the waters.

One advantage they have is the sheer number of card carrying law and social science students registered.

In my days and from limited experience , it was all hands to the pump on virtually any issue under the sun.

From initial round the coffee table meetings , such organisations as Shelter and Friends of the Earth , with Greenpeace half a generation later , were spawned.

If only we carers had access to such resources .... ???

The last thing children need to be told is their grandparents got things done and , more efficiently.

I'm willing to wager that our generation still has more names on the tombstone displayed behind any student union bar for drinking records and feats !!!

A yard of ale ? It was a firkin in my days !
76 posts